Marvin Shilmer

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Posts by Marvin Shilmer

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  49

  What are the costs of literature cart witnessing?

  by oppostate in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  in the article on the guardian ( http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jul/14/jehovahs-witnesses-evangelism-church-god-armageddon ) mentioned in another thread, there's this quote of mark omalley, who is assigned to the public information desk at the jehovahs witness uk centre in north london.

  we now have more than 165,000 [literature] carts on the streets in over 50 countries.

  it gives us visibility and availability.

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  Marvin Shilmer

  The cost of these things must be far, far less than the enormous fuel cost to publishers for driving around in oil-burners. In my case, I could have paid for one of these set-ups and easily saved my household 2,000 dollars (US) annually.

  So what's the difference? I know who got the thousands of fuel dollars annually. The guy who owns the local pumping station! Who gets the revenue for the do-nothing cart-setups? I have no idea. But the "time" is a lot easier. You just stand there and do nothing!
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  33

  Transcription of interview with Rabbi Michael Berenbaum regarding German JW's in the concentration camps

  by Saintbertholdt in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  a while ago i transcribed a video interview with rabbi michael berenbaum from the university of judaism.

  the interview concerns jehovah's witnesses during the second world war in the german concentration camp system.

  berenbaum is a historian and specifically researches jehovah's witnesses during the shoah and also the idea of martyrdom.

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  Marvin Shilmer

  
  Renunciation Document Under Nazi Germany
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  12

  A WT "prophecy" that finally came true?

  by eyeuse2badub in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  at long last, after 140 years of failed prophecies, it appears that the borg finally got one right!

  recall the odd little article published back in the november 15th, 2013 wt about the 7 shepherds 8 dukes (anti-type) and the evil assyrian (anti-type) and some silly nonsense about the assyrians attack on the vulnerable wtbts.

  page 20 paragraph 17 of that strange article contained this foreboding prophecy from the faithful and discreet slave, (anti-type);.

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  Marvin Shilmer

  Watchtower's 1958 illustrated prediction that actually came true: The Urge — Watchtower’s ironic prediction
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  128

  Looking Back In Retrospect To 1975...

  by titch in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  greetings, folks: so, it's been 40 years since 1975. and, if you were actively involved with the witnesses back then, the mindset of many was, that by early autumn of 1975, it would mark the anniversary of 6000 years of human existence.

  and, the hope was then, that it would mark the start of the 1000-year of christ, from the heavenly realm.

  but, looking back now, 40 years ago, in june of 1975, only 3 more months remained until early autumn.

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  Marvin Shilmer

  I lived the 1975 fiasco. One incident I recall was an ongoing debate between three congregation servants (now called elders) about how long the great tribulation would last leading up to Armageddon. One felt like the GT would last about 5 years hence he expected things to really start getting nasty for JWs in 1970. The second felt like the GT would not have to last longer than 1 year. The third felt like both men were full of crap because no one could know the day and hour hence the whole discussion was speculative, including the part about 1975 potentially seeing Armageddon. The debate between these three men went on for several years. At nearly every social event where I'd encounter the three men I'd hear the discussion continue. I'd also hear it at after meetings at the KH. These guys could not let it go. All three remained as JWs. Two are deceased now and the third (the more reasonable 'no one can know the day and hour' guy) remains as active elder to this day. Last time he and I spoke I raised this incident and the long debate he had had with the other two and he said he didn't recall the three of them ever discussing the matter.
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  26

  Sir David Eady to give judgement on the Watctower Appeal in the Otuo v Morley and Watch Tower case at the High Court tommorrow

  by Adwoa Kromo in

  1. forum
  2. announcements

  sir david eady sitting as high court judge will hand down judgement tomorrow at 11:00am in the appeal of the decision from master leslie for refusing to strike out the claim as an abuse of process.

  in his judgement in november 2014 he stated in his judgement delivered ex-tempore " i am bound to say that this case causes me a good deal of trouble".

  from notes that i have from the hearing last week, i will be utterly surprised if the retired judge sir david eady takes a different view.

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  Marvin Shilmer

  From the judgement:

  "I bear in mind Mr Daniel's warning that I may be allowing myself to be diverted by a "smokescreen", but it simply illustrates why the facts need to be properly investigated after full pleadings have become available, disclosure of documents has taken place and witness statements have been exchanged. Only then will the smoke have cleared."

  Mr. Daniels works for Watchtower. It's ironic that on one hand Watchtower complains judicially of a smokescreen yet simultaneously depends so heavily on smokescreen to keep the public from knowing what really happens inside its self-organized and managed shunning program.

  Watchtower has done this before. In 1981 take a look at how Watchtower complained about lack of public view and review:

  
  Criminal trials were doubtless much speedier in Israel than they are at present in countries such as the United States, where clogged courts and elaborate procedure give rise to many delays. Since the local court was situated at the city gates, there was no question about the trial being public! (Deut. 16:18-20) No doubt the public trials helped influence the judges toward carefulness and justice, qualities that sometimes vanish in secret star-chamber hearings. What about witnesses? Witnesses in Bible times were required to testify publicly. For this reason they were warned not to be influenced in their testimony by the pressure of public opinion “so as to turn aside with the crowd in order to pervert justice.” Perjury was not punished with a jail term, but with whatever punishment the false witness had sought to bring upon the defendant—even death!--(Awake, published by Watchtower, January 22, 1981, p. 17)

  To this very day Watchtower disallows third-party viewing of its "judicial" activities even when requested by the accused. The very safeguards Watchtower admits as important the result of public review it rejects by disallowing third-party viewing (when it's requested).

  Watchtower's tactics in the public arena are beyond contempt. The organization's leadership is overloaded with rot. It is beyond repair or reform.

  
  
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  9

  Shunning... the thing jdubs don't speak of

  by freemindfade in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  standing in the back now during the wt study.

  looking ahead i find it comical paragraph 14.

  "...you know how disfellowshipped ones are to be treated.

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  Marvin Shilmer

  
  Watchtower Shunning – Deadly by Design
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  65

  WT October 15, 2015 - Don't believe Apostate Lies

  by Designer Stubble in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  the last article in this new wt, shows me that the organization is dealing with much information that is damaging them.

  i am sure that the many recent lawsuits are being noticed by the r&f.. here are some gems from that article, titled the naive person believes every word.

  we must be very selective about what we consider worthy of our attention.

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  Marvin Shilmer

  Compare:
  "...forwarding research material, verses extracted for Bible study, or answers to use at congregation meetings would detract from the value of each individual’s personal preparation."--The Watchtower, October 15, 2015, p. 31

  
  With:
  "... in Jehovah’s organization it is not necessary to spend a lot of time and energy in research, for there are brothers in the organization who are assigned to do that very thing, to help you who do not have so much time for this, these preparing the good material in The Watchtower and other publications of the Society."--The Watchtower, June 1, 1967, p. 338
  
  Translates as:
  It's perfectly okay for "brothers in the organization" to forward research material, verses extracted for Bible study, or answers to use at congregation meetings if they are handpicked by Watchtower to do this, but if other "brothers in the organization" forward research material, verses extracted for Bible study, or answers to use at congregation meetings it would detract from the value of each individual’s personal preparation.
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  5

  Has Anyone Asked Bethel About Contradiction of White Blood Cells in Milk?

  by berrygerry in

  1. watchtower
  2. medical

  would intravenous insertion of milk into a human be wrong?

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  Marvin Shilmer

  The issue has been put before Watchtower leadership so many times it's pathetic. Facts don't mean anything to those dishonest hucksters.
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  109

  The Confederate Flag

  by Simon in

  1. social
  2. current

  the latest controversy over the confederate flag just sums up to me the state of dysfunction that exists in american society.. in summary: a white supremacist nutter shoots 9 black people dead in a church.

  he's clearly inspired by the messages of others which the confederate flag is often a symbol of.. it seems like a no-brainer to remove it.

  not only isn't it removed, it isn't even lowered at all as a mark of respect.. and of course now there are the people who want to defend their right to have it.

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  Marvin Shilmer

  • Marvin,... you are being a little naive here...

    Perhaps you should take a harder look at what I've said. A much harder look.
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  109

  The Confederate Flag

  by Simon in

  1. social
  2. current

  the latest controversy over the confederate flag just sums up to me the state of dysfunction that exists in american society.. in summary: a white supremacist nutter shoots 9 black people dead in a church.

  he's clearly inspired by the messages of others which the confederate flag is often a symbol of.. it seems like a no-brainer to remove it.

  not only isn't it removed, it isn't even lowered at all as a mark of respect.. and of course now there are the people who want to defend their right to have it.

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  Marvin Shilmer

  What we need to be asking is how are we going to make substantive changes to achieve a truly color blind society.

  Causes of the woes you mentioned faced by contemporary human society are much, much bigger and more complex than skin color.

  For starters, the view from one-million miles in space is that humans are essentially a sophisticated form of bacteria eating away at planet earth's resources, which resources are not infinite.

  For seconds, no matter skin color humans are, like most other life forms, very selfish.